Commons talk:Media for cleanup

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[edit] PNG scaling.

I have found that some PNGs, typically 256 colour or lower ones, cause problems when scaled. The filesize is increased greatly, eliminating some of the benefits of using PNG over GIF. See more here. I think something should be added here, related to the problem, and whether or not GIF should be used in some situations instead.--Drat 06:16, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Due to the questionable copyright status of the GIF format, it is best for Wikipedia to use PNGs instead, regardless of file size. --Wulf 04:20, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Not copyright, patent. A whole different beast. And not really applicable to serving the files, but it is possible that it may be un-viewable (although I don't think any of the companies have ever gone after authors of read-only software...) --71.98.25.209 20:43, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

All the U.S. patents have been dead for several years by now, and the last lingering semi-dubious international patents will supposedly expire by August 18th (i.e. 6 weeks away). Churchh 04:17, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I would imagine that converting the PNGs to greater color depth wouldn't affect their filesize significantly but would allow for much better anti-aliasing when sampling down. Would that help the situations you've encountered? Bryan Derksen 23:45, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the problem is that the inefficient PNG "thumbnailer" rescales ALL PNG images as 32-bit RGBA, regardless of whether the input PNG is a greyscale, or palette color. Changing a 256-color PNG to 24-bit RGB color or 32-bit RGBA color can actually significantly increase image size, without helping thumbnailing at all (the way it's currently done). See further discussion at Template_talk:BadGIF Churchh 01:40, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Problems with {{BadGIF}} template

User:Sanbec created Template:BadGIF, but given that the last few remaining semi-dubious non-U.S. patents on GIF are soon due to expire, and that Wikimedia software currently simply doesn't handle PNG thumbnailing as well as GIF thumbnailing in many cases, I think this template is quite pointless. Since "Sanbec" hasn't had the courtesy to respond to my comments anywhere (neither at User_talk:Sanbec, nor at Commons:Village pump, nor at Template_talk:BadGIF), I would feel inclined to nominate Template:BadGIF for deletion, if I knew the proper procedure to do so. GIFs have a place here as long as the 800px alleged "thumbnail" of Image:1812-neoclassical-Young-Ladies-at-Home.png is still five times the size of the "high resolution" version!! Churchh 04:17, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup or improving might not be improving

Following a discussion at the village pump about preserving linkable originals of improved images, I realized that everyone might not like their uploaded images to be modified and replaced. So I went ahead and created Template:Cleanup_image_done for the case when the original is not replaced. It can be added to all modified images and their originals to create a cross-link.

[edit] TeX to SVG?

Are there any freely available tools to convert TeX (or EPS) to SVG? If so, it should be mentioned here. Otherwise, it is quite pointless to put TeX-generated formulas in the "convert to SVG" category.--Gunther 12:03, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

pstoedit doesn't work: Using -f plot-svg, the font information is lost, and the file generated by -f svg is rejected on uploading ("This file contains HTML or script code that may be erroneously interpreted by a web browser.").--Gunther 13:00, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

Update: The following works for me:

latex
dvips -E
pstoedit -xscale 2 -yscale 2 -dt -f sk
skconvert

I learned this trick from Gustavb.--Gunther 00:57, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Mediawiki supports LaTeX natively. (<math>) [1] --Kim Bruning (talk) 09:30, 26 March 2009 (UTC) $\int\frac{dmath}{dt}=math$

[edit] Problems with SVG files

Hello, I'm french and my english isn't good. I want to upload SVGfiles but something is wrong and I don't know what : Image:TravailForce2.svg, Image:Quadrature parabole3.svg, Image:Hyperbole torricelli.svg. So I have to upload PNGfiles. I don't understand because this file Image:Indivisible1.svg is good. Please, if you want to explain me what is wrong, use french or basic english. Thank you.HB 15:20, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

All the files except Indivisible1.svg are full of references to files on your computer. Mediawiki does not support svgs using other files. You will have to edit the images and delete the png references. Also, note that there are sometimes problems with the Inkscape SVG format, and it's better to save them in Plain SVG instead. (Toutes les images sauf Indivisible1.svg sont plein des references aux fichiers png dans ton ordinateur, tu peux les ouvrir avec Bloc-notes pour voir (cherche png). Essaye renommer le dossier Wikipedia sur ton disque dur et puis regarde avec Inkspace comment sont les images. Après avoir vu ça c'est facile à corriger. Aussi, c'est mieux à enregistrer les fichiers en format Plain SVG au lieu d'Inkscape SVG, il y a des problèmes parfois.) --Para 15:05, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you! I have to learn more about Inkscape and export function. I shall try later to upload plain SVG file without link to other PNGfiles. Ciao. HB 16:46, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Some wikis cannot use SVG and need the original JPEG or PNG retained

Wikia is a current example. Its standard list of usable types is ".png, .gif, .jpg, .jpeg, and .ogg". Can I be sure the "upgrades" to SVG will not result in destruction of originals? Robin Patterson 15:51, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] automatic conversion to SVG

Is there any way to "automatically" convert images from GIF/PNG to SVG format? I don't know anything about vector apps, and don't have much talent at normal bitmap editors either. ⇔ ChristTrekker 18:21, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

There are various vetor "tracing" programs, but if the graphic is at all complex, then the result of tracing usually demands some manual cleanup in order to be usable as a good SVG conversion. Churchh 12:42, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Vector Is Not Always Better Than Raster For Diagrams

In some cases it is a worse alternative. The reason for this is that diagrams comparing display resolutions should be constrained to the same limitations that the displays themselves are - pixels. It is one of the few cases where a raster representation is more accurate than a vector one. ~ [ 69.14.222.228 19:23, 30 December 2006 (UTC) ]

SVGs allow the "default" pixel dimensions to be defined in the file and in this case the SVG version of that diagram defaults to within a few pixels of the same dimensions as the PNG version. I see no advantage the PNG has over the SVG in this case and several advantages the SVG has; SVG is more robust when resized to other dimensions (since very few people actually have a 2560 × 2048 display that's going to happen in pretty much every situation), it allows the image to be edited more easily (for example if new screen resolutions need to be added) and pixels are completely moot when the thing is printed out in any event. Bryan Derksen 23:43, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

I've been looking around at several different conversions of PNG to SVG. The images in question are Image:2007-02-20 time zones white bck.svg and Image:NTSC-PAL-SECAM.svg.

Concerning fine viewing, the timezone image increased from 1.34MB to 2.48MB and worse, the NTSC-PAL image increased from 55kB to 2.8MB. I don't believe the advantages of SVG outweigh the increase in filesize. Certainly not for the NTSC-PAL example anyway. hrf on en.wikipedia 87.127.160.172 23:51, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

The SVG file isn't actually downloaded unless one goes to the image page and explicitly clicks the svg download link, though, so the file size isn't all that important a consideration. MediaWiki converts the SVG into a raster image for display, the SVG is the "source code" of the image that's more useful for future modification. Bryan Derksen 08:54, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

The problem with converting other formats to SVG is that it can't, in general be any better definition than the original file. And the primary advantage- that it scales- is rapidly disappearing- most browsers and other ways of displaying raster formats have ways of scaling images too. In the general case, they're equivalent. So converting images across is wrong-headed- it's a net waste of time.Wolfkeeper 03:43, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Logos

original png

Should logos of companies, brands etc. be converted to svg or png? And if I am not mistaken because svg is vector can it be resized infinetly without "jaggies" of jpeg? If so how do you resize an svg image or rescale it to make it larger or smaller? Ywenyo 17:08, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Logos should be svg, yes. They are not resized or scaled by editing the image; the plus to an svg is that you can make it larger than the original upload size, infinitely. For example take the images to the right: the first is added using [[Image:12 Victoria symbol.svg|thumb|original size]] meaning it shows up at the original size, while the second has a |100px| added to make it 100px wide.

Now, if you try that with the png you get what is on the left: the second is what happens when the image is forced to be 100px wide even though the original image was only 33x40px. SVGs can be told to be any size you want, infinitely; though of course monitor size restricts how much of the image will be seen. No editing required, and the filesize is nice and small while still allowing for very large images. -- Editor at Large • talk 01:02, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

original svg

svg at 100px

This is wrong. If the company doesn't provide a suitable format, then you shouldn't convert it for them. It's OR. And blowing up an SVG above the size than the original is provided at is OR also- you don't know how it was supposed to look at larger resolution than it was produced at.Wolfkeeper 03:47, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

The english wikipedia original research rule is enwiki only, and need not apply on commons. Even then, it is not intended to be taken to insane extremes. (for instance, I do not believe that mediawiki supports NTSC transmission :-P) --Kim Bruning (talk) 09:50, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Is this an appropriate action or is it vandalism?

This "clean up" of [2] ( Image:Louvre ; École Francaise -Philppe de Champaigne.jpg) is not a good idea. If the portrait is used as an illustration of the article on "mantle" or "sleeve" or on the anonymus sitter it would be appropriate. If the painting is shown as an example of de Champaigne's art the proposed clean up is vandalism...

Would you cut a part of a painting like this if it was on your wall?

Robert Prummel 14:32, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Creating a second separate image for the cropped version would seem like the appropriate way to go. I wouldn't call the request "vandalism" since I doubt it was actually meant to be malicious, though. It's just not the right approach. Bryan Derksen 07:06, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

There are often cleanup requests to remove the frame from images of paintings. On a quick look there seems to be some remnants of a frame in this image too, but looking at the museum's image, ours is just unfortunately framed. To make this bad copy of the painting less bad, would it not be good to correct the perspective and crop the bottom left corner to make the bottom horizontal again? --Para 09:00, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "lossless cropping tool such as jpegtran"

"consider using a lossless cropping tool such as jpegtran" - can this be clarified? What is a "lossless cropping tool"? Do everyday, widely used free programs such as MS Paint, Photoshop, and Paint Shop Pro count? - MPF 11:21, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Not when working with jpegs. Re-saving them can result in lossy compression on a image already saved with lossy compression, resulting in image quality loss. And for the record, jpegtran is freer than the other tools mentioned, it is open source. -N 01:53, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Guess I'll have to see if I can get hold of it. Is it safe to install? A while ago, someone recommended I try to get a svg-editing program, but I couldn't install it as on trying to start, it gave a warning that it might damage my computer (a risk I didn't want to take). - MPF 22:57, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Was it Inkscape? What you saw was a disclaimer of liability in case something went wrong, not a warning something would go wrong. -N 23:00, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

Think so, yes, but can't remember for certain. - MPF 23:20, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Use the freeware Irfan View 4.0 including the plugins. Under option you find the loseless operations.

[edit] Further questions

How could I know which programs employ lossless compression and which not? For example I use PhotoFiltre and Paint.NET, besides IrfanView. Do these employ lossless compression? --Chech Explorer 13:23, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

JPEG (in its commonly used forms) is an inherently lossy format. All programs which create JPEG files for web use do so in a manner involving lossy compression of the image data.

The discussion above was about a few highly-specialized programs which can manipulate previously-existing JPEG files without introducing any further lossiness beyond what already existed. (Most general-purpose image editors can't do that...) Churchh (talk) 10:45, 14 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] two pic to clean up

Hello, I am sorry I am not able, I am not made to work with pictures.

Perhaps someone can turn - mac os x preview can not :(

It's now rotated. --Baikonur 18:44, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

a couple of month ago I uploaded which is too dark

its donem hope you like it. --Marku1988 17:24, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

Best regards, --Lofor 23:26, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Thanks a lot! mfg --Lofor (talk) 02:35, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Rotate - Bot

Hi all, I create a new template in User:Luxo/Template:Rotate with the parameters |degree=90/180/270 ~~and |direction=left/right~~. I will create a bot, who rotate this images automatic by this template (only 90/180/270°). The new template I move not until the bot is finished. What do you think? Any incitations, comments, ideas? Thanks--Luxo 20:52, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

Sounds good. Make sure to copy the EXIF data too and to reset the EXIF orientation tag after. --Para 21:01, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I use "jpegtran" for rotate jpg's, I will set the orientation tag after rotating to "1" (normal)[3]. for png and gif rotate I will use ImageMagick.--Luxo 22:07, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

It's a nice idea. The bot will rotate only images tagged with "90/180/270" and ignores images with other parameters – do I have this right? --Christian Nurtsch ^TM 12:37, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

Correct - other degrees must made by hand for a good result.--Luxo 17:42, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

As long as you're using lossless methods (jpegcrop/jpegtran) it's a great idea. I used to end up rotating about 15 images a day to keep the cat empty, though it seems others are working on it now as well since the category manages to stay fairly clean. A bot to do standard rotations would be wonderful and a great help. -- Editor at Large • talk 17:59, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm owner of the account User:Bilderbot (Bilder = German Image) - this bot runs only 1 time a month. ~~I think I let the rotate-bot work under this account...~~--Luxo 17:14, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

I registered a new account for it, User:Rotatebot. I think I let it check every 6 hours the category for images. (00:00, 06:00, 12:00, 18:00 UTC)--Luxo 17:22, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

You can't upload a new version because your account is too new. <-- Ok, in 4 days the bot works \o/ The images in Category:Images requiring rotation by bot must made by hand or waiting 4 days... :)--Luxo 23:15, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] derivative works uploader

Hi all, I create a new tool for easy uploading derivative works. You will be able to add one or more original-files, and the tool check for license compatibility and propose you a description. When uploading, the tool should add a notice to the original files if desired. If you have any ideas about features or something go to User:Luxo/derivative works uploader and propose it there. Tank you--Luxo 16:29, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Examples

The examples given in "Images with unnecessary borders" do no more exist, I suggest you to use other example images or remove the links. 90.134.89.2 01:04, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Disputing a "Rename media"

What is the proper procedure to dispute a {{Rename media}}? // Liftarn

[edit] Border removing advice needed

Hi, I remove borders and frames from time to time and today I found two images which I don't know how to handle. They have borders only in the corners. Here is an example. How should I proceed in such cases? Should I just crop off the bottom and top of the image or maybe it doesn't need to be cropped at all? --Chech Explorer 13:19, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Converting graphs to SVG

this graph has been tagged for conversion to SVG. Is this typical? In what manner would one do this? --Kim Bruning (talk) 09:46, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

See Help:SVG. Churchh (talk) 15:29, 18 April 2009 (UTC)

[edit] Why am i getting this error?

This file contains HTML or script code that may be erroneously interpreted by a web browser

The image is a JPG from a NASA document found here. Why am I getting this error? Why is the warning so indecipherable?

Maury Markowitz (talk) 23:59, 21 September 2009 (UTC)