User talk:82.212.68.183/Archive

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Also feel free to ask a question on my Talk page. I will answer your questions as far as I can! Thank you again for contributing to Wikipedia. // FrankB 19:54, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Prior note[edit]

Im replacing the images that are not featured pictures or Quality Images and replacing them with FP's (English has the rule that they should not be non-featured images, I dont know about Svenska). I realize you are helping with the translations and I appreciate that. I am done with October and November POTDs and will not be replacing them, however there are some in December that not featured pictures and will probably be replaced. Sorry, and thanks again for helping with the translations. --Digon3 01:53, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Sincere thanks, unhelpful changes and Kudos[edit]

re
unhelpful edits versus good work-Kudos on the template!

I've a ton of email notices about edits by your removing (mainly) {{W2}} or {{W2c}} from articles. I commend you rushing in to make some fixups, but your efforts are contrary to the need of keeping the text on these pages totally portable (identical) between sister projects. Most of these will now not work on other sites.

Since you are also the invisible collaborator making this premature but good start fixup, we need to confer ASAP. Saving non-expanded templates in templates is worth no one's time. They are documentation and links, which is very important, and don't load the server in any significant way.

Your edit on {{interwikitmp-grp}} was excellent, and it's clear your wikimarkup knowledge superior to my humble skills, but ignores needs-realities. The interwikitmp-grp needs appropriate logic to NOT present a site, as there are naming collisions now and again.

Please contact me by email, here on my talk, and lets work together vice against one another. I've made maybe 20 reverts in two years, and you just presented me with the unpalatable task of a need for more than a dozen, and all that mis-focused energy is contrary to portability, a key design specification of the scheme.

re these and others 20-22nd:

  1. 22:58, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterlinkswp (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  2. 22:56, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterlinks (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  3. 22:55, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sistercommons (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  4. 22:54, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sistermetawiki (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  5. 22:52, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikiversity (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  6. 22:51, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwiktionary (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  7. 22:51, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikisource (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  8. 22:50, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikibooks (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  9. 22:50, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikiquote (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  10. 22:48, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikispecies (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  11. 22:39, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwiki (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  12. 22:38, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikinews (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  13. 22:37, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterend (ordinary wikilinks) (top)
  14. 22:36, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterwikipedia (ordinary wikilink) (top)
  15. 22:34, 20 January 2007 (hist) (diff) Template:Sisterheader (template for ordinary wikilinks is not needed)

Thanks, really! But working at cross purposes without a gameplan independent will just waste both our time. Best regards // FrankB 19:57, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

This is Wikimedia Commons, so the templates here will can only be used here. You cannot transclude templates between projects. If commons has some good templates those can be copied to sister projects that has use for them. But the templates needs to be adjusted to the guidelines and needs of those projects there, not here. I am most familiar with Wikipedia and Commons, and do not know very much about the needs and guidelines of the other projects. But I have noticed that many of the templates you have copied there has been deleted because they were unneeded. You are building a large and complex structure of templates that might not be needed on all the sister projects.
Commons is a very special project because it is multilingual and all languages are equal. English is the most widely understood language so it is the most used language here, but that does not make the other languages any less important. Everything you do for English should also be possible to do for all other languages. That means that you cannot make special templates for English or rely only on English Wikipedia.
If what you are doing is some Commons project, I think it will be interesting to see links to the Commons or Commons talk pages that discusses this project. If it is only a one man project of yours I suggest you present your ideas and the goal of your project in the Village pump or the bistro to get comments from other users before you continue. /82.212.68.183 22:06, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
Interwiki is interwiki -- the idea is to make tools available from the place where they originate to other places where others can use them. Those sisterlinks templates have been ported to en.wikipedia for example, and many of their and Meta's templates have been brought to here. Software is software, and your allegation templates from here won't be useful elsewhere is exremely unthoughtful. The experience is contrary—something useful in A is most often useful in B as well. Many smaller projects with their inherent undermanning do not have the capability or personnel manning to come up with tools that have been in place and are well debugged on the senior project.

More to the point, the project to provide a origination source link so other sites can check and compare across all projects will aid those sites in finding other tools, ones not categorically emplaced as part of the interwiki support scheme. Most of those affected now are either really good handy tools, or tools like {{W2c}} which support identical language and links. Hand editing the page for each site is ridiculously time intensive. Why would you demand that of someone? Worse, you just began fiddling without even having the courtesy of making an inquiry, and under the stigmata of being an Anom—while attacking many man-hours of thought, debugging and effort. Frankly, I resent that. There are several very intensive man-hours involved in this on my end, time when I should have been working my business, not working for the benefit of whatever wiki's. Being an anom, it's rather hard to assume you are trustworthy. OTOH, my work is known on most of the sisters, and I'm easy to approach by email.

This project hasn't been promongulated anywhere yet simply because the correct forum is on Meta, and I have been away. There are a fair number of people that have been consulted on them along the way, and who have helped in some respects. Frankly, when it all began I knew next to nothing about templates, so there has been a lot of input by others. The en.wikipedia implimentation was overhauled last minute only because I worked several nights without sleeping before I had to travel. It takes big chunks of time, and now that I'm getting some regular wikitime again, it doesn't help the effort to find someone tearing it apart before it gets fully debugged. At least have the courtesy to discuss things before tearing into the work of another when you don't have a clue as to the reasons behind things!!!

Presumably, an Spanish wiki would adapt the template language to Spanish, but the working body of the template, and the logic of the software is the important parts. Most any editor can modify the language for their national language. You, however, have taken out the guts of what makes them portable. Now every site will have to hand edit them if used including a pipetrick. That Swedish, French or Spanish wiki is quite as capable of adapting W2, W2c to there needs, and such. Trivial templates like that neither take up a lot of expansion space when the server builds a page, nor server time. So even as typing aid used on many pages, they have little impact. They do have important effect in copying a template from one sister to another. Many sites will not accept their own prefix for their own pages. More to the point, they link across the sisters of a given language.

I've been away three months dealing with important matters in RL or would have had this {{interwikitmp-grp}} (these actually-- see Fabartus#NPOV_templates aired as a Meta-project, specifically discussed with the Communications committee thereon, which oversees such interlingual issues as you perceive apply. I see that quite differently. However, the de facto common language and common tie point of all projects is the en.wikipedia and here... both in English. These two sites and their pages have interwiki's to all the sister's regardless of language in their two categories. The same is true of templates for the most part-the templates have to be English. Rejecting that premise is just asking for anarchy and insanity. The second inter-category effort {{WikipediacatA}} is far superior to the sisterlinks effort which is just too fraught with error prone editing needs to be pragmatic. It at least promises some computerized relief and universal applicability as contrasted with the endless man-power needs sisterlinks would need as a universal solution—and then suffer from being a static solution so that when a category name or article is changed on a site, the links would be broken. My category scheme developed here on the commons does not have those problems... or won't if the programmers do the coding I have suggested.

Of the two, the category task is more important, and your edits have kept me from planned cleanup on that today, not to mention following up on the programmer status of that. Even if they say no, linking the commons categories tightly to en.wikipedia's will aid all users in finding stuff, including making sure the underutilized interwiki links of today's software potentially get updated and looked at in both places. In short, communication and linking is good, per WP:Btw.

If you have your way, Wikimedia Foundation will see the last of my efforts. It's simply too costly to defend good thinking against whomever comes along without even making an inquiry, an unforgivably narrow discourtesy. Never mind that your professed objection strongly suggests some kind of nationalistic pov is in play on this. The number of interconnects should have been obvious and were apparently ignored as well. Maybe you aren't a big picture thinker, I don't know. Maybe your narrow perspective is correct, if so, I can use the spare time for real life. I certainly don't have time for many more occurences of some tearing down the work of others. Since you seem to have seen David's Post on TFD, you should already know that about me. I don't suffer foolishness gladly. In the meantime, I suggest you come out from hiding. I have no use for anoms--they take responsibility for nothing. // FrankB 02:44, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Signing up[edit]

Hey, you seem to be a knowledgeable user who is probably active on other Wikimedia Foundation projects, why not sign up here? Thanks, Yonatanh 19:05, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I am User:82.212.68.183 from Swedish Wikipedia. Some things may be a little bit easier for logged in users, but I can do most of what I want to do here without logging in. /82.212.68.183 21:31, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
Fair enough, as long as you keep on making good edits. ;) Yonatanh 00:22, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Re:Page protection[edit]

I have no idea what are you talking about. I've never added any page to any category and I even do not know how to do it at all, but thanks for your message anyway--Mbz1 17:36, 7 June 2007 (UTC)Mbz1

Anon[edit]

Welcome![edit]

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Feel free to ask me any questions you may have on my talk page. By the way, remember to sign and date your comments with four tildes (~~~~). --Nolanus (C | E) 20:47, 12 June 2007 (UTC)