File talk:Historical totalitarian leaders.jpg

Colorized version

I am uploading a colorized version of this image here — 以上未签名的留言是由该用户加入的： Bop34 (留言 • 贡献) 20:49, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Pinochet

I have added [Pinochet] to the image for the following reasons:

• He is a well-known totalitarian dictator whose policies are still present to some part to this day.
• Its important to state that totalitarian tendencies exist in all socioeconomic views regardless right or left, and Pinochet is a good example of neoliberal totalitarianism.
• A sixth picture was needed to equate sizes of grids.

--Comrade-yutyo (留言) 12:19, 10 January 2022 (UTC)

I have changed the image for Francisco Franco. His regime lasted 39 years (1936–75), while Pinochet's lasted 17 years (1973–90). In addition, Franco was not removed from office, since he remained until the end of his life (Pinochet was removed in 1988 referendum). Other leaders that could be added would be: Enver Hoxha (39 years in office), Nicolae Ceaușescu (22), Ne Win (26), Pinochet himself, Francisco Macías Nguema (11), Pol Pot (4), Hideki Tōjō (3), etc. Jarould [talk] 02:52, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

talk I think this is a bad faith edit. Pinochet as a neoliberal laissez-faire capitalist should have been on that list to clarify that its not socialism or nationalism that can have authoritarian tendencies. Also the so called free market capitalist mode of production has figures like Pinochet that was authoritarian. Franco is a fascist like Hitler and Mussolini who are already represented in the image. The image currently gives the impression that the neoliberalism is the only ideology that doesn't tend to generate any authoritarian tendency whatsoever while it does. Also years of power is not an indication of totalitarianism but the policies done under administration are, and Pinochet is a prime example of that. --Comrade-yutyo (留言) 18:12, 12 January 2022 (UTC)

@Comrade-yutyo Mind that accusing an user of bad faith is considered a personal attack.

On Pinochet, I do not agree. The file is called historical totalitarian leaders, so it is meaningful to include dictators from the same period, aka WW2. Then, I see what you want to prove, but regardless the economic model, both Pinochet and Franco can be politically associated to the fascism or anti-communism area (Pinochet's regime was build mimicking the Spanish one[1]). After Franco's death, Spain had to go through a long process of transition to restore democracy. -- Ruthven (msg) 08:24, 10 March 2022 (UTC)

The only thing that really matters is providing reliable sources that describe someone as a totalitarian. Anything less is plain old w:wp:OR Dronebogus (留言) 15:55, 10 March 2022 (UTC)

I don't think that finding sources in that sense is very difficult :)

• Omar G. Encarnacion (2014年) 《 Democracy Without Justice in Spain: The Politics of Forgetting》
• Gabriela De Lima Grecco (2020年) 《 Literary Censorship in Francisco Franco's Spain and Getulio Vargas' Brazil, 1936-1945: Burning Books, Awarding Writers》、​Sussex Academic Press
• Stanley G. Payne (2011年) 《 The Franco Regime, 1936–1975》、​第413頁
• etc.

However, I see your point: an authoritarian regime is bounded by laws and rules, and has a (very) limited form of pluralism, when a dictactorship has no "higher authority" to answer to and generally an unique party. The case of Spain tends more to the first, following the sources, at least in certain periods of the regime. It is a totalitarian dictactorship (like Hitler's or Mussolini's in other periods). From this point of view, Franco deserves more to be in this list wrt Pinochet, more for temporal reasons than political (the two regimes were very similar ideologically, with a stronger influence of the US in Chile, but the WW2 was over and anticommunism was the main political guide for Pinochet: there is no political difference, maybe only economic, but it's due to the differences between Chile and post-war Spain). --Ruthven (msg) 08:59, 15 March 2022 (UTC)

Whitewashing of Pinochet

I am reporting people now that removed Pinochet, added Pol Pot over it to whitewash Pinochetist regime. Here isn't the platform to pursuade blatant anti-communism where totalitarianism is attributed to only left to show right as libertarian. --Comrade-yutyo (留言) 21:19, 9 March 2022 (UTC)

@Dronebogus, Comrade-yutyo, and Ezequiel 449: I see that edit warring is continuing. I've reverted to a "wrong version", i.e. one that you do not agree upon (but that has been discussed above). Any further change to this collage must be discussed here, and eventually done with consensus. Thanks for understanding. --Ruthven (msg) 18:47, 19 May 2022 (UTC)

Comrade yutyo is a POV pusher who refuses to learn from past mistakes. Their edit history here and on WP in relation to political subjects shows that. Dronebogus (留言) 21:21, 19 May 2022 (UTC)

your message why the revert says it's because you don't know who the character is.., and that's why you change it. idk Ezequiel 449 (留言) 00:23, 20 May 2022 (UTC)