Category talk:Deaths from murder

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Unmove Victims of murder to Deaths from murder[edit]

This category has since the dawn of time been titled Victims of murder (first Murder victims). It was changed last April as part of a set of cat renames - some unsupported - that utilized an unresolved discussion process (note the timing) to determine facts. The declared purpose was, allegedly, to match this cat's name with the "Deaths from..."-fashion line, giving no account to the fact that "Deaths from murder" is an absurd English, unsustainable wording - as everyone who's murdered is dead; while Victims of murder makes the plain sense; - modifying names to match them with word-format at the parent-cat should not compel with obsession all the more when clearly in certain cases these acts are done pirately (by a bot permission-holder) as a way to implement power as substitution to keeping arguments.

Rename back to the the original category's title, for the love of logic, sense and coherrent language. Orrlingtalk 20:26, 18 August 2012 (UTC)

The changes affected many categories, a general discussion is open at Commons:Categories for discussion/2012/05/Categories of victims, fatalities, deaths. My view is that categories of deaths should not be confused with categories of people by manner of death. See Category:Death of people which is really indented for deaths as events.
should not be confused with
Category of victims (as people) should not be confused with categories of deaths (as events). As I know English, "dead" is a person, "death" is an event. "Deaths from murder" are simply equal to murders, "Victims of murder" are simply "murdered people". --ŠJů (talk) 21:25, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
Lets not complicate matters too much and play with word nuances. Or will you rename the thousands cats in Category:Deaths by year ? The killed people in Norway are all deaths too; one could argue for ever if they are murdered, slaughtered, massacred, killed, shot, ... . --Foroa (talk) 21:41, 19 August 2012 (UTC)
But this is not the point, the point is which word we should use to adress a category relating to people who died - be it drowning in the river or shot in a massacre. Killed people are first-and-foremost dead, not deaths. Cat:Death by year is of course irrelevant as we've just made the point that a "death" is an event hence no need to change it. Victims of murder gives a plain clear wording solution, noting that we're talking about the individual people themselves and not their murder - which is covered at cat:Death of people (which I, personally, think it should be "Deaths of people"). Orrlingtalk 15:10, 20 August 2012 (UTC)
I'm inclined to favor "Murder victims", since "Deaths from murder" sounds more like images of crime scenes and less like headshots of people who were later killed. As for consistency, why not make it consistent with Category:Victims of crime? WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:00, 29 March 2013 (UTC)


There are currently 126 subcats here, and I'm thinking that it would benefit from subdivision. Category:Murder victims by century? Category:Murder victims by country? What do you think? WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:59, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

Seems sensible. — Cheers, JackLee talk 15:54, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
Category:Deaths from murder by century and Category:Deaths from murder by country seems more in line with current category naming. --Foroa (talk) 16:43, 31 March 2013 (UTC)