Commons:Village pump

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Welcome to the Village pump

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Broadwick St, Soho, London: a water pump with its handle removed commemorates Dr. John Snow's tracing of an 1854 cholera epidemic to the pump. [add]
Centralized discussion
See also: Village pump/Proposals • Archive

Template: View • Discuss  • Edit • Watch
# Title Replies Participants Last editor Date/Time (UTC)
1 Attribution issues and Media Viewer 12 3 Adam Cuerden 2022-05-25 08:10
2 Making ALT text part of Commons 21 7 Jmabel 2022-05-26 22:59
3 File moving 6 2 Jeff G. 2022-05-26 12:20
4 Help for identifying wild orchis 2 1 Yann 2022-05-26 11:39
5 Uploading a file provided by a friend 7 4 Jeff G. 2022-05-22 21:52
6 GSoC'22: Improving the custom picture selector 4 3 Jeff G. 2022-05-23 10:53
7 I made Template:LGBT symbol 5 3 El Grafo 2022-05-23 13:46
8 Is it an Robinia pseudoacacia? 3 3 Wouterhagens 2022-05-23 12:51
9 Move file to original name 3 2 Jmabel 2022-05-24 19:59
10 Wikimedia Sound Logo contest discussion 1 1 VGrigas (WMF) 2022-05-25 00:10
11 Lynching 6 3 Adam Cuerden 2022-05-26 10:24
12 Cannot correct the structureed Geodata of some files 3 2 トトト 2022-05-25 14:37
13 Struggle to get a photo deleted 5 5 King of Hearts 2022-05-26 08:12
14 Effect of deletion 4 3 Peacemaker67 2022-05-26 07:51
15 Topic list 3 3 Jeff G. 2022-05-26 14:18
16 Report on Voter Feedback from Universal Code of Conduct (UCoC) Enforcement Guidelines Ratification 1 1 Zuz (WMF) 2022-05-26 10:23
17 Moving Cabalism to Qabalah 14 3 AnandaBliss 2022-05-27 20:23
18 Wich cat in English? 4 2 Jeff G. 2022-05-28 11:44
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May 10[edit]

Attribution issues and Media Viewer[edit]

So, as you may know, there's a bug in Media Viewer, that's existed for 8 years, where if a file has more than one Creator template, or a Creator template and a text attribution to another creator, it only returns the name of the first creator as the credit. So, for example, in a Brady-Handy photograph, only the first of them will be listed on Media Viewer. On a collaboration such as File:Humanité René Philastre and Charles-Antoine Cambon - Set design for the second part of Victor Hugo's Les Burgraves, première production.jpg, you can choose whether it credits Humanité René Philastre or Charles-Antoine Cambon, but not both.

Since it's been made very, very clear that it's not going to be fixed any time soon, I think we can fix it on our end relatively easily. All we need to do is to check the input, and if it either A. has text outside of a Creator and/or Wikidata template, or B. has more than one Creator/Wikidata template, we can add the following code:

{{Information field |name= |value=See file page for creator info. |class=fileinfotpl_credit |id=fileinfotpl_credit |style=display:none; |stylevalue=display:none; |classvalue= }}

Ideally with internationalised text. I suppose there should be an override for if people want to enter the credit manually, but... let's be honest, the percentage of people that would even know about the bug so that they knew they had to fix it manually is tiny.

It's better to do it on our side, so that in the unlikely event the bug is ever fixed, we can simply pull the code out. Adam Cuerden (talk) 16:57, 10 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This is quite frustrating. When using {{Artwork}} at least is shows "PersonX and n other authors" (example). But if you can override the default and let it show "See file page for creator info", doesn't that mean you should also be able to force it to show whatever you want, including the correct author(s)? El Grafo (talk) 14:46, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
In theory, yes. Although it might require some clever a code to strip author info from whatever Creator templates are used Adam Cuerden (talk) 15:09, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I think the easiest way might be to add something to the base Creator template to have it return the name of the creator. Might require a certain amount of bot work to modify existing Creator templates (probably just add a mode= switch to all of them, but I think it'd work. So the credit line would just add mode=nameonly to the Creator template using lua. Adam Cuerden (talk) 17:32, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Adam Cuerden, I think all you are trying to do is for the Commons templates to be broadcasting hidden metadata that will inform Media Viewer about what attribution to display. I think that can be done by improving {{Information}} template. I always considered Media Viewer as kind of broken as it usually displays nonsense matadata. Then there was hope that the code can read Structured data and not rely on noisy wikitext. However If there is some published documentation on how to set the metadata so it shows correctly in Media Viewer we can try to set it correctly. --Jarekt (talk) 04:22, 16 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Jarekt: With the code I quote above, we can improve it by replacing "See file page for creator info." with a better credit line; the trick is going to be getting the better credit line. Adam Cuerden (talk) 18:46, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
</nowiki> Adam Cuerden (talk) 18:45, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Adam Cuerden, {{Information}} or {{Artwork}} templates can access Wikidata items of Creator templates in the "author" field. I am just not sure if that is helpful. --Jarekt (talk) 18:55, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Let me do a code dive. It at least gives us a start. Adam Cuerden (talk) 20:56, 17 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
This appears to be Template:Label/Module:Wikidata label, though I'm not quite sure I see how the wikidata number is extracted. Adam Cuerden (talk) 00:35, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Okay. Going to do some diving. Adam Cuerden (talk) 22:47, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I can't figure out how to get a name from a Creator: template, but that does allow us to cover any case with one Creator template or less. I'll go with that and we can improve from there? Adam Cuerden (talk) 08:10, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 11[edit]

freedom of panorama in the US: paintings on buildings[edit]

Hi, newbie here doing some research about FoP. I've understood that freedom of panorama in the US only applies to buildings, which do not include other 3D arts and 2D art. However according to Leicester v. Warner Bros., paintings on the exterior of buildings are integral parts of the buildings, thus included in the FoP. Is it safe to say that those paintings, murals and graffitis are with FoP so suitable for Commons (talking only about paintings right on the buildings, not about posters or separate paintings which are not parts of buildings)? Taking the mural in Quebec City for example, if this were located in the US and within time period of copyright protection, would this mural still be under FoP in the US because it's an integral part of the building? Thanks --Suiren2022 (talk) 01:36, 11 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 18[edit]

Making ALT text part of Commons[edit]

User:DrMel brought this up at our latest Seattle meetup; User:Peaceray and I are helping to flesh it out.

Be My Eyes has a large network of blind and sighted people who can collaborate to create ALT texts for images. DrMel is pretty certain that this network of people would be interested in providing ALT text in a variety of languages for a large number of our images, especially those that are used in Wikipedia in the various languages. However, there would need to be a clear decision on how best to store of this content and solid support for the process of creating it (and presumably for using it in Wikipedia). We've thought some of this through, but I think it still needs to be kicked around a bit before making a proposal.

Kleine gedigten voor kinderen - KW 2220 G 15 - 012-012a.jpg

Just to be clear: ALT text is meant mainly for the blind and vision-impaired, and is distinct from the description in {{Information}} or from the SDC caption. Basically, good ALT text is intended as a substitute for being able to see the image. E.g. a short English-language ALT text for File:Kleine gedigten voor kinderen - KW 2220 G 15 - 012-012a.jpg might be "Two facing pages in an old book. On the left is a poem in Dutch; on the right is an etching. Both are entitled 'Het Medelijden' (in English, 'Compassion'). The etching shows a well-dressed roughly 8-year-old boy at left dabbing his eye with a handkerchief and, at center, a young woman with a mournful look, but not to the point of being completely distraught, sitting in a simple wooden chair. To the right of that, in the background and slightly less distinct, a man lies in a canopied bed, presumably a sickbed. There is a door open to outdoors at extreme left, and a few domestic items scattered about suggest modest domesticity, just above the level of poverty."

We think the best vehicle for storing this would be a new property corresponding to Wikidata item alt attribute (Q1067764); it could be used in SDC and also within Wikidata: for example, this could be useful on a Wikdata item referring to a work of art. (Wikidata may or may not want such a thing, since, like captions, it is not internally structured, nor is it entirely objective.) Each value for a statement using the property would require free text for the content, plus a qualifier indicating the language.

We would need tools that let someone look at the image while creating this content, possibly some system of marking these for a review process (that could be as simple as a template placing them in a subcat of Category:To be checked), and, if we want to make this really useful, a templating approach for Wikipedia (and other sister projects) analogous to en:Template:Cite Q that would allow such ALT text to be pulled in as needed, to form ALT text where the image is used.

@DrMel and Peaceray: Anything important I've left out? Anything I got wrong?

Anyone: thoughts? comments? - Jmabel ! talk 19:09, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I do not like the Cite Q template idea. The model I want is alt-text additions to a File: page are automatically inserted in the appropriate pages. That way, wiki pages that already use a file do not need to be edited; the alt text would just appear. MW already does something similar with multilingual SVG files. When an SVG file is translated to German, then the German wiki automatically displays the German version of the SVG file. There is no need to add |lang=de to each page on the German wiki that uses the file.
MW already generates alt= text or uses an option. (mw:Help:Images#Syntax) The file included above contains alt="Kleine gedigten voor kinderen - KW 2220 G 15 - 012-012a.jpg", alt text generated from the simple filename. MW would have to implement a more involved alt-text default.
Glrx (talk) 19:59, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It would be wonderful if we could skip the templating part, but as I understand it getting alterations made to MW is a much higher bar. If you think we could get that to happen, though, it would be great. - Jmabel ! talk 21:12, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I think it must be part of MW for the project to be successful. It is relatively easy to get people to add translations using SVG Translate. If those people also had to edit the wiki pages, then I doubt many would do it. Automatic insertion also has the advantage of avoiding errors.
Yes, software updates to MW take forever, but alt text has a slight advantage: w:Americans with Disabilities Act. WMF does not sell anything, so it does not have to follow ADA, but it would be tough for Maryana Iskander to say ADA upgrades should not be done. Glrx (talk) 21:38, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
"does not have to follow ADA" Perhaps that's not a legal requirement, but making our content accessible is certainly a moral one. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:49, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I guess having a piece of StructuredData that is actually being used in the wild routinely would also be a bit of a boost for the whole StructuredData initiative ... El Grafo (talk) 15:00, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Much as I'm in favour of SDC, I don't want to promote it at the expense of damaging accessibility. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:24, 20 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I meant that more as a motivation for WMF to get things done properly. --El Grafo (talk) 10:14, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Your example illustrates well the deficiency of providing "alt" text without regard to context (and note that a proposal for such a property has multiple objections on this basis): In many cases, the best value might be, or include, a transcription of the poem. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 10:49, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Pigsonthewing: Yes, I thought of that, but was trying to give a concise example. Since the content of a direct quotation is absolutely uncontroversial, there didn't seem much point in my transcribing that as part of a proposal. - Jmabel ! talk 13:04, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • I very much like this idea - alt text is too often neglected. However, alt text is often contextual; what matters in an image depends on the usage. For example, consider File:Mrs Vanderbilt ElectricLight.jpg. On en:Electric Light dress, the alt text should discuss the dress in some detail, while on en:Alice Claypoole Vanderbilt the alt text would not need to describe the dress. Pi.1415926535 (talk) 21:51, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
    • Well, whatever we do it should be possible for a given usage to override any default ALT text from Commons, but for most images my guess is that the same well-written alt text would work for all uses. - Jmabel ! talk 22:28, 18 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
      alternative alt text
      thumb with alternative alt text using the alt= parameter
      Alt text for a thumb can already specified manually using something like [[File:foo.jpg|thumb|description|alt=alt text]]. Just keep that functionality and let it override the default alt text specified at Commons and everything is good. Love the idea, btw. El Grafo (talk) 14:49, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I definitely support adding alt text to files through structured data. I think using a property would not be a good way as it is not so convenient with multiple languages. As the caption is the label parameter of wikidase we maybe could use the currently not used description parameter for the alt text. --GPSLeo (talk) 14:40, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I'd want to work with the Wikidata community on whether this should be a new property. I'm not sure if 'description' is a good choice, because one would think it should relate to the "description" in {{Information}}.
Pinging @Peaceray, DrMel please do weigh in either to say that this is the discussion you wanted or to raise any issues where I'm not bringing in your ideas. - 22:29, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Description would only be the field in the database and how to call it from the API. The GUI of course would say alt text. --GPSLeo (talk) 06:33, 20 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
That's messy, though, isn't it? Better introduce a new field that is properly named. API users are humans too. --El Grafo (talk) 10:10, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I think that this is most worthwhile. As Jimmy Wales one said, Imagine a world in which every single person on the planet is given free access to the sum of all human knowledge.[1] There is no question in my mind that extending Wiki[mp]edia capabilities to better serve our blind users would serve this purpose.
I think that having default alt= parameters for .svg files or via the MediaWiki software is a good thing, but we can make alt= more useful by extending it. It would be good to enter an alt text for each language, like a language specific label for a Wikidata item or the Captions in the File information section of the file.
There are probably a few ways this alt data could be used, but I think that creating an alternative to "Use this file on a Wiki" would be an appropriate place to start. Take File:Centre College, 1847 engraving.png for instance. Right now "Use this file on a Wiki" only generates:
  • [[File:Centre College, 1847 engraving.png|thumb|Centre College, 1847 engraving]]
It does the same for Deutsch, English, Español, et cetera, despite having captions in eight different languages.
Now imagine being able to use the different language captions, plus the alt text, for however many languages were entered. Perhaps we could come up with a way to generate something like the following.
  • For German:
    [[File:Centre College, 1847 engraving.png|thumb|alt=Ein Stich von Lewis Colilins aus dem Jahr 1847, der die Haupthalle des Center College und die Residenz des Präsidenten auf der rechten Seite zeigt, mit Bäumen um sie herum und einem Zaun im Vordergrund, der diagonal von der vorderen linken Ecke verläuft.|Gravur des Centre College, 1847]]
  • For English:
    [[File:Centre College, 1847 engraving.png|thumb|alt=An 1847 engraving by Lewis Colilins depecting the main hall of Centre College and the president's residence on the right, with trees about them and a fence in the foreground running diagonally from the front left corner.|Engraving of Centre College, 1847]]
  • For Spanish:
    [[File:Centre College, 1847 engraving.png|thumb|alt=Un grabado de 1847 de Lewis Colilins que muestra el salón principal del Center College y la residencia del presidente a la derecha, con árboles a su alrededor y una cerca en primer plano que corre en diagonal desde la esquina frontal izquierda.|Grabado de Centre College, 1847]]
Peaceray (talk) 05:32, 20 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]


  1. Roblimo (28 July 2004). Wikipedia Founder Jimmy Wales Responds. Slashdot.
@Peaceray As far as I understand, the idea behind this is to go even further than that. General-purpose alt texts in differend languages would be specified for a file at Commons, and software magic in the background would automatically deliver them whenever the image is used (unless overridden because a more specific alt text is needed for the given context). ← that was me a couple of days ago, somehow my signature got lost. --El Grafo (talk) 14:01, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I'm wondering if there is yet something concrete enough here to propose at Commons:Village pump/Proposals. Would a loose proposal there be the best we to proceed, or can someone suggest a different way? - Jmabel ! talk 20:05, 24 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I created a proposal: Commons:Village pump/Proposals#Adding alt texts through structured data --GPSLeo (talk) 18:38, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Again Pinging @DrMel, Peaceray to participate in that proposal discussion. - Jmabel ! talk 22:59, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 19[edit]

File moving[edit]

Yesterday there was something wrong, but it's fixed now. What's not fixed, I have it for a week now, is that during renaming there comes a little screen thay says 'Deze pagina vraagt te bevestigen dat u deze wilt verlaten - gegevens die u hebt ingevoerd, worden mogelijk niet opgeslagen' (in English: 'This page asks to confirm that you want to leave - data you receive may not be saved.'. This normally happens when a page is not fully loaded yet, but this is during renaming. When I rename a couple of files at the same time, with only a short time-difference, sometimes a renaming doesn't work, and I can still find it on the 'request page'. This pc is 'old', but this weekend I was somewhere else, and I had the same problem. Does anybody know? I work with Firefox, the latest version. It also sometimes happens when I only rename one file.- Richardkiwi (talk) (talk) 16:24, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Richardkiwi: I got something like that, too, but not related to renaming. I chalked it up to my scripts not having fully loaded, but now I wonder. I will try to screenshot next time.   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 16:29, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Jeff G.: - Ok, we will see :-). I got on error also, but it was only a few minutes (like yesterday, the pink screen). I can make a screenshot too, but it's in dutch and I have to upload it to Commons (or something). - Richardkiwi (talk) (talk) 16:33, 19 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Richardkiwi: On my laptop, I get a dialog entitled "Leave site?" with advice "Changes you made may not be saved." and buttons "Leave" and "Cancel".   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 12:00, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Jeff G.: - Yes, I had the same. At the moment, no problems. Yesterday a few times, but it was very often in the week before 20 May. - Richardkiwi (talk) (talk) 12:05, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Richardkiwi: That's good news. On my iPad, I get an untitled dialog with two buttons, "Stay On this Page" and "Leave this Page".   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 12:20, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 20[edit]

Help for identifying wild orchis[edit]

Hi, I need help for identifying wild orchis

Thanks a lot! Yann (talk) 19:40, 20 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

✓ Done on French Wikipedia. Yann (talk) 11:39, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 22[edit]

Uploading a file provided by a friend[edit]

If I have a file that a friend provided me directly, and he asked me to help him upload the file, what options should I choose while uploading? Since it is not downloaded from the internet or other sources.--Borueichen (talk) 15:19, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Borueichen: Hi, and welcome. You may upload it now as your own work, but then immediately tag it as {{subst:PP}} and have the photographer post permission on their website or social media, send it via VRT, or clarify how the sublicensing or copyright was transferred to you.   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 15:41, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
And also immediately correct the "author" field of {{Information}}. - Jmabel ! talk 20:02, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There seems to be a similar problem with File:Herb Robert Geranium robertianum Potawatomi State Park Wisconsin.jpg. According to the current version of the source, [1], someone else (presumably the "author's" mother) took the photo. Is this o.k. or is there something that should be done about this? --Robert Flogaus-Faust (talk) 20:16, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Robert Flogaus-Faust I think it is ok and I doubt something should be done about it. Editor B (the Flickr uploader) claimed permission from his mom Ruth Everson in this edit. She could send permission via VRT.   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 20:26, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I am sorry; I somehow missed the answer and never read it before the thread got archived. Thanks a lot! --Robert Flogaus-Faust (talk) 20:38, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Robert Flogaus-Faust It's not your fault he posted to the archive and didn't ping you.   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 21:52, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

GSoC'22: Improving the custom picture selector[edit]

File picker showing differently pictures that have been uploaded to Commons already

The Commons Android application is the official Android application for Wikimedia Commons. The app allows authenticated users to upload pictures from their Android phone/tablet to Wikimedia Commons. The app has multiple features like uploading an image, editing categories of an image, nominating an image for deletion, nearby upload, a leaderboard based on the number and quality of uploads, an enhanced custom picture selector, and much more.

Custom Picture Selector: The app has a custom picture selector which has the ability to show the images differently which have already been uploaded while selecting images for upload. The feature indicates an already uploaded image with a Commons icon overlay, thus it's saving time and improving the user experience.

Issue: Some images are not meant to be uploaded to Commons, like family pictures, personal images, images with copyrights e.t.c. The contributors will try to avoid those images while uploading some images to the Commons app and might want to see only those images which can be uploaded to Commons.

Solution: This project solves the problem by letting users manually mark images as Not For Upload. The feature will indicate a not for uploaded image with a 🚫 overlay icon (and grey them out). There will be a button to show only uploadable images which means if the contributors turn on that button the already uploaded images and not for uploaded images will be hidden. Thus, it allows the contributor to more easily spot pictures they might want to upload.

Additional Features:

1. Bubble Scroll Bar: A bubble scrollbar will be added so that users can easily locate the picture they are scrolling for. The bubble will show the date on which the pictures were taken.

2. Enhanced full-screen mode: Fullscreen starts when the user long-press any picture in the custom image picker. For a good user experience, the full-screen mode will be enhanced such that the user can do all operations while staying in the full-screen mode. It will make the app more convenient for the user. A small overlay will be shown on the left corner of the full screen indicating whether the picture is selected or not, showing the number of selected pictures. Swipe Left/right to go from one picture to another. Swipe up to select the picture. Swipe down to immediately mark that picture as Not for upload.

Phabricator ticket:

--Ayan184 (talk) 17:55, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Ayan184: Thanks, but will my complaints at Commons talk:Mobile app#Deletion (and the others on that page) ever be addressed?   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 18:34, 22 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Jeff, we just fixed one of them, it will be in the next release which is imminent. Thank you for the feedback always! Syced (talk) 01:15, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Syced: Thanks!   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 10:53, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 23[edit]

I made Template:LGBT symbol[edit]

Gay Pride Flag.svg
Red section sign.png
Legal disclaimer
This image contains a symbol that represents sexual minorities, including gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender.

Use of these symbols may be punished according to applicable laws in Iran, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Uganda, the United Arab Emirates etc. In addition, using these symbols for the purpose of discriminating against sexual minorities may be subject to punishment under anti-discrimination laws in the United Kingdom and Sweden, etc.

This template was created by looking at the state of homosexuality laws that differ from country to country.

(Don't get me wrong. I'm not gay.)

How about this?

And can we translate it into different languages?

Correction of content due to errors is welcome.

Ox1997cow (talk) 07:56, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

First impression: Compared to, say, {{Nazi symbol}} or {{Terrorism symbol}}, this is quite vague with a lot of "etc." El Grafo (talk) 09:53, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
We recently decided not to implement a template for "Z symbol" wich is problematic to use in many democracies. We should not add a disclaimer for every symbol forbidden in some oppressive states. For the purpose we have the Commons:General disclaimer. --GPSLeo (talk) 11:01, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Service: discussion on "Z symbol" at Commons:Village pump/Archive/2022/03 § Create {{Z symbol}} or not?. --El Grafo (talk) 13:46, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@GPSLeo: Then, which these template have a problem?
If you think some templates have a problem, you can nominate for deletion some templates. --Ox1997cow (talk) 11:49, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Is it an Robinia pseudoacacia?[edit]

Grote boom bij Schepenpad in Spijkenisse.jpg

The leaves look the same, but it is such a big tree. Most of the Robinia pseudoacacia are much smaller. Are the fruits correct? In other images these fruits are much more gathered together and on specific fruit branches.Smiley.toerist (talk) 11:38, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

This is definitely not Robinia pseudoacacia, R. pseudoacasia has much smaller pinnate round leaves (and they are less glossy). Based on the fruits I would say that this is some unidentified Fabaceae tree. — Draceane talkcontrib. 12:14, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
It looks like a Pterocarya fraxinifolia. Do you have more photos (close up, of the bark)? Wouter (talk) 12:51, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Move file to original name[edit]

I request that Special:permalink/657140008 be fulfilled to restore the original episode name given by VOA. Thx. Roy17 (talk) 22:47, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • Could an admin who knows Chinese please do this? I hesitate to make a move where I really don't know what is going on. - Jmabel ! talk 23:03, 23 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  • It looks like this proposed move is the subject of a dispute. - Jmabel ! talk 19:59, 24 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 25[edit]

Wikimedia Sound Logo contest discussion[edit]

Wikimedia Sound Logo contest discussion

Hello everyone,

The Wikimedia Sound Logo contest is under discussion here, and your input on the talk page is appreciated: There will also be two video conversations on Friday May 27 @11:00 UTC and Tuesday May 31 @15:00 UTC, in case you want to chat live.

Thank you!

VGrigas (WMF) (talk) 00:10, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]


If you know the history of lynching - and that's a phrase I really don't want to have to use - you'll know that accusing the victims of some awful crime is pretty standard, and usually completely spurious. File:Lynching-1889.jpg has a description that looks to buy in 100% to the accusations of the people who killed the guy. I'm just... going to delete that, unless we can put it in hellish amounts of context. Adam Cuerden (talk) 06:33, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hey there, what other phrasing would you propose using for this file? I think the term "lynching" is easily understood and widespread. What the victim may have done might not be a crime nowadays, but it likely was at the time of the picture being taken - so it'd be the best description for the event. Unless there's some source affirming that this person did not actually commit any crimes, I don't see a reason to use a different term. It doesn't aim to attack the individual shown either - the description is written neutrally, and he's described as a victim. -- Aimarekin (talk) 14:07, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
See en:Lynching of George Meadows: They just killed someone who had the same skin color as the rapist/murderer. The victim begged them not to, because she could not identify him. The next day the sheriff decided he was innocent. The text Adam removed was:

"George Meadows, "murderer & rapist," lynched on scene of his last alleged crime."

That uses quotation marks, but without knowing the story behind this, these can mean a couple of different things. I have linked the Wikipedia article now - that's probably better than trying to tell the whole story in the file description. El Grafo (talk) 14:27, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
I've also removed the file from Category:Criminals from the United States, as it seems quite clear that he is one of several victims here. --El Grafo (talk) 14:31, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
There's also File:George Meadows, murderer & rapist, lynched on scene of his last crime LCCN2012646363.jpg and File:George Meadows, murderer & rapist, lynched on scene of his last crime LCCN2012646363.tif that need to be dealt with. Already fixed at source [2]. --El Grafo (talk) 14:36, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Ech.... Stuff you find while trying to go through POTD stuff on en-wiki. (Well, by way of trying to figure out why a file was on the bad image list.) Adam Cuerden (talk) 10:24, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Cannot correct the structureed Geodata of some files[edit]

I have tried to correct the structureed geodata of these files but couldn't. Why cannot some files be edited in the structured fields?

These are obviously wrong, and I want to synchronize with the data in the {{Location}} of both files, which I managed to figure out. --トトト (talk) 12:45, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@トトト That's strange indeed: the "publish changes" button for coordinates of the point of view (P1259) just won't work for me. Adding a depicts (P180) to the first file worked just fine. Does that happen for all files or just some? --El Grafo (talk) 14:11, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Not all files, of course. I think it happens in some of old files in commons. In this file (Ajiyoshi Junior High School East Cross 20131212.JPG) I had had difficulty just changing a category, but eventually I was able to do it a few days after I reported to this village pump. I have no idea if any admin or WMF people silently fixed it or no. --トトト (talk) 14:37, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Struggle to get a photo deleted[edit]

I have tried several times to get this foto deleted:

Simple reasons: 1) It was uploaded by mistake 2) It's not my photo 3) It's in violation with the license and is a copyright infringement. Please advice what I can do to fix this. I have thousands of quality images uploaded here and this is, to my recollection, my very first deletion request. This whole process has not been a great experience. --Bep (talk) 17:51, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

  • @Bep: You were asked directly, "Are you the photographer of this photo? Are you the photographer of the other photos of the series? If there is some difference with this photo and others of the series making them ok for free licenses but this one is not, could you please explain what it is?" You never answered. - Jmabel ! talk 18:17, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
(After edit conflict) Looking through the history at Commons:Deletion requests/File:Sogndal-Raufoss 310720 Igoh Ogbu-1.jpg you have probably alienated some other users by being evasive and offering confusing answers. There is at least one comment there from someone who said they would !vote delete as a courtesy if you gave them a clear explanation, but you didn't respond (at least not on that page).
To stand a chance of deletion here, you will need to give a clear explanation of what happened. This is one of a series of images from an event that you claim to have made and released here under a free licence. Why is this one not your image when the others are? From Hill To Shore (talk) 18:27, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
From looking at the (kept) DR for the cropped version of the image I assume, that Bep wants to have this file deleted, because them strongly dislikes the cropped version (that might be deleted as COPYVIO, if the original file was deleted). --C.Suthorn (talk) 19:45, 25 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Note: I've bought up a similar image which had been deleted as Commons:Undeletion requests/Current requests#File:Sogndal-Raufoss 310720 Daniel Eid-1.jpg. -- King of ♥ 08:12, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 26[edit]

Effect of deletion[edit]

G'day, if a file page currently displays a free image (the top image, so to speak), but there is a previous version of the file in the history which is a copyvio, if there is a deletion request for the file/page, presumably all the versions of the file are also deleted, including the current free version? The example I am referring to is here. Thanks, Peacemaker67 (talk) 07:35, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That would be a revision deletion (revdel. Only one (or more but not all) revision of a file is deleted. As there is already a DR you might want to point out there, that a revdel is wanted. --C.Suthorn (talk) 07:42, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
✓ Done I also blocked UserNameSRB for edit-warring and abusing overwriting. Yann (talk) 07:47, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Of course, thanks all! Peacemaker67 (talk) 07:51, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Topic list[edit]

I've added a list of topics in the header. I wonder if this will help the discussion run more smoothly. Any comments would be welcome, thanks. Kanashimi (talk) 09:18, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Report on Voter Feedback from Universal Code of Conduct (UCoC) Enforcement Guidelines Ratification[edit]

Hello all,

The Universal Code of Conduct (UCoC) project team has completed the analysis of the feedback accompanying the ratification vote on the Universal Code of Conduct Enforcement Guidelines.

Following the completion of the UCoC Enforcement Guidelines Draft in 2022, the guidelines were voted on by the Wikimedian community. Voters cast votes from 137 communities, with the top 9 communities being: English, German, French, Russian, Polish, Spanish, Chinese, Japanese, Italian Wikipedias, and Meta-wiki.

Those voting had the opportunity to provide comments on the contents of the Draft document. 658 participants left comments. 77% of the comments are written in English. Voters wrote comments in 24 languages with the largest numbers in English (508), German (34), Japanese (28), French (25), and Russian (12).

A report will be sent to the Revision Drafting Committee who will refine the enforcement guidelines based on the community feedback received from the recently concluded vote. A public version of the report is published on Meta-wiki here. The report is available in translated versions on Meta-wiki. Please help translate to your language

Again, we thank all who participated in the vote and discussions. We invite everyone to contribute during the next community discussions. More information about the Universal Code of Conduct and Enforcement Guidelines can be found on Meta-wiki.

Best, Zuz (WMF) (talk) 10:23, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Moving Cabalism to Qabalah[edit]

The current Category:Qabalah redirects to Category:Cabalism. The issue is, that the Cabalism WikiMedia page was originally meant for cabals, ie secret or conspiracy groups. The page is a strange mix of both: it's linked to the en:Cabal and its cabal (Q1416414) WikiData page is mostly about cabals as well. But the content is entirely about en:Hermetic Qabalah, or non-Jewish forms of Category:Kabbalah. I tried to make some changes months ago, but I don't know enough about WikiData to make any moves so I reverted all of my edits. What is the proper way to go about taking the current content of Cabalism and changing it back to the Qabalah WikiMedia page, with links to the Hermetic Qabalah Wikipedia page? AnandaBliss (talk) 14:19, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I have fixed several of the links in your message. I'll try to look in to this if I get time later (a bit hectic at work this week) unless someone else responds first. From Hill To Shore (talk) 15:53, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
My suggestion for sorting this out:
  1. Content should go in a new Category:Hermetic Qabalah.
  2. Category:Qabalah and Category:Cabalism should become disambiguations.
  3. Category:Kabbalah and Category:Hermetic Qabalah should each get a {{See also cat}} or other appropriate tag pointing to the other.
    • Done; incorporated existing hat text. - Jmabel ! talk 15:17, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  4. In Wikidata, Category:Kabbalah is already correctly aligned; Hermetic Qabalah (Q1613576) should link to the new Category:Hermetic Qabalah.
  5. I've already removed the incorrect link from cabal (Q1416414).
Jmabel ! talk 18:22, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Unless anyone objects in the next 24 hours, I'll move forward on that basis. - Jmabel ! talk 18:25, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Hi user:Jmabel, that works for me, thanks so much! It's been bothering me for quite a while but I don't know my way around well enough yet to get it all done. AnandaBliss (talk) 20:29, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Just to add one more thing, I think that the categories Cabalistic books‎ and Cabalists‎ should be moved to Qabalistic books (or maybe Books about Hermetic Qabalah) and Qabalists, respectively, just to keep everything as consistent as possible. AnandaBliss (talk) 20:35, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Largely completed. User:AnandaBliss, would you please look at the remaining content in Category:Cabalism and sort it out to the proper categories? Thanks. - Jmabel ! talk 15:17, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've looked everything over, thanks so much! I've also moved the rest of the contents of Cabalism into Hermetic Qabalah. Should I put in a separate request for the other category name changes? AnandaBliss (talk) 15:40, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@AnandaBliss: Ah, missed those. I'll have the delinker do those, since they are simple cat moves. - Jmabel ! talk 17:10, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks so much again!! AnandaBliss (talk) 20:23, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Wich cat in English?[edit]

Hi there.

I have problems while categorizing some pics of Levée de la Divatte because I don't know the exact term even in French so even in English... I don't find anything in the Commons' cats. And I'll have 300 files (or more) to upload.

This levee has many accesses to the Loire river, kind of "doors". Some of them are small accesses to stone stairs (*1) (1 meter width or less), small piers, small private or public slipways (*2) (2-3 meters), big accesses to a harbors (*3) for river barges, or to vegetable farming (*4) (famous Val-de-Loire products) or former river sand loading scales (*5) (15-20 m width). All are made to recieve a "cofferdam" (*6) in case of high flood. Each one wanted to access the bank at the foot of their home, to fish, to moor their boats (important commercial ports on the Loire, before and after the levee). Each "door" has a number (1 to 107) so I'll have to create 107 cats and they cannot be in one unique cat.

So, my question is: how do I call these "doors"?

Here some links to Streetview to see what's about:

Thanks a lot for help. lol LW² \m/ (Lie ² me...) 23:27, 26 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Llann Wé²: I think you could make Category:Loire River access points as a subcat of Category:Loire River, or Category:Gaps in Levée de la Divatte as a subcat of Category:Levée de la Divatte. You could also make one or more subcats of Category:Marinas in France, if necessary.   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 00:15, 27 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks a lot, good idea Jeff.
I wrote almost it... but I didn't think to name them like that... It'll be a mix: cat:Loire River access points in Levée de la Divatte because this 15km levee is not the only one along the Loire.
Have a nice w-e. lol LW² \m/ (Lie ² me...) 01:59, 28 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]
@Llann Wé²: You too, and you're welcome.   — Jeff G. please ping or talk to me 11:44, 28 May 2022 (UTC)[reply]

May 28[edit]