File talk:Incarceration Rate by Sex and Country.svg

From Wikimedia Commons, the free media repository
Jump to navigation Jump to search

Need a table just for female rates

[edit]

The scale on this makes it fairly useless for female rates for most countries. --Timeshifter (talk) 14:09, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

In most countries, the percentage of incarcerated women is indeed very low. That's precisely what the *chart shows.Guarapiranga (talk) 22:04, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Guarapiranga. It is much more comprehensible now that you have added the numbers to the chart. Thanks.
I think a table would be more useful. Then it is OK to have both female and male rates. Then a static row number column could be added to it. That would allow people to sort for either the male rate of incarceration or the female rate.
Right now the chart is only sorted for the female rates. --Timeshifter (talk) 22:43, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I resorted it by total rates. Guarapiranga (talk) 21:59, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

World Prison Brief. Rates by sex

[edit]

Guarapiranga. WPB has percentages of prison population by sex. I have looked around and do not see rates per population by sex in the WPB data. Here a couple country pages:

Where did you get your data for incarceration rates by sex? --Timeshifter (talk) 17:52, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

From the female and the total rates. Guarapiranga (talk) 22:01, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Guarapiranga. Please provide the exact formula you used.
You must have created a statistical table of results in order to create the bar chart. I see the data on the chart now.
Please provide the table below the license and page description. This is often done on the Commons. That way people can choose to use either the table or the chart in various articles.
And it allows people to import the data into spreadsheets in order to verify, or to incorporate it into other tables. Or to break it up in various ways. --Timeshifter (talk) 22:36, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Timeshifter: Please provide the table below the license and page description.
Here it is. Not sure exactly where you'd like me to put it on this page. Please feel free to add it in yourself. Cheers. Guarapiranga (talk) 00:03, 3 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Guarapiranga. I was wrong. World Prison Brief does has female rates of incarceration, but it is not on the overview tab for country pages. The only thing on the overview tab is this: "Female prisoners (percentage of prison population)". But there is a link to the "Further Information" tab.

On that tab there is "Female prison population rate (per 100,000 of national population)". That is total population male and female. For example on the United States WPB page the rate is 64 per 100,000 in 2016.

To get the female rate of incarceration per 100,000 female population one has to get the female population of the US for 2016. Doing that for over 200 countries is a lot of work. Which is why it is better to go with the older info here:

Looking at your female data on your chart I see that is where you got your numbers from. Which is fine. --Timeshifter (talk) 10:02, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Very difficult to follow from country name to data

[edit]

Since there is no row highlighting as in a table with class=mw-datatable it is very difficult to see to which country a rate number applies. Another reason this needs a table option too. --Timeshifter (talk) 22:47, 2 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Is that better? Guarapiranga (talk) 02:04, 3 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
A little bit better. But not much. It is still difficult at times to follow across from the country name to the data. I believe it is possible to add gray lines to charts such as these. From the country name to the data.
But I think the best solution is to use a statistical table instead. Then sorting of any column is possible. --Timeshifter (talk) 12:09, 3 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The table is in the article. The chart is an illustration of it. Guarapiranga (talk) 21:56, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The table in the article has male and female percentages of the prison population.
The table in the article does not have male and female rates of incarceration.
--Timeshifter (talk) 13:06, 5 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Your male incarceration rate calculation formula is producing highly inaccurate results

[edit]

How are you calculating the male incarceration rates?

I looked at the US male and female incarceration rates here:

Your current chart has 5060 per million for US males. And 1330 per million for US females. That is way wrong for the male rate. --Timeshifter (talk) 10:04, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There is no "formula"; it's just the complement. If US incarceration rate is 6390 per million, and the female rate is 1330 per million (people, not women, as it's quoted by the source), then obviously the male rate is 5060 per million (people, again, not men). Guarapiranga (talk) 11:53, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
For the US: 1330 per million FEMALES. The number of females per million TOTAL POPULATION is 640 in 2016. See here:
https://www.prisonpolicy.org/global/appendix_2018.html - 1330 per million FEMALES.
https://www.prisonstudies.org/country/united-states-america - 640 per million TOTAL POPULATION.
Using your method: 6390 - 640 = 5750.
So the male rate (5750) per million population (both sexes) would be around 9 times higher than the female rate (640) per million population (both sexes).
But this method does not work when using the female rate per million FEMALES (1330 per million). Your chart currently uses rates per million FEMALES. That is what your 2018 source uses.
The correct way to get male incarceration rates per million MALES is much more complicated and time consuming than your formula. See next talk section. --Timeshifter (talk) 13:15, 5 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Suggest changing this to a female rate only chart. I have file mover rights, and can change file names

[edit]

Guarapiranga. I like your chart when it is only the female rates. Ordered by highest to lowest rates.

If you show the female rates only, I can change the file name to something like "Female incarceration rate by country". I have file mover rights on the Commons.

The description can link to this:

It can quote that page:

Incarcerated women in other countries: The number of women incarcerated in each country was calculated based on the Institute for Criminal Policy Research’s World Prison Brief’s Highest to Lowest - Female prisoners (percentage of prison population), which provided the percentage of each country’s incarcerated population that is female, and the corresponding list of incarcerated population totals for each country. (For some countries, the World Prison Brief includes some number of girls in the numbers of incarcerated women.) Women’s incarceration data was not available for Cuba and Uzbekistan, which were included in our overall Global Context report.

And the description can point to the column of female incarceration rates in the appendix:

--Timeshifter (talk) 10:22, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Why do you want to hide men? That's just sexist. Guarapiranga (talk) 11:48, 4 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Haha. Well, to get the male rates you would have to through every country page on the World Prison Brief. You would have to subtract the females from the number of people incarcerated. Then calculate the male incarceration rate per million males. You would have to look up the male population of each country. It is not on WPB. All of this would take a long time. --Timeshifter (talk) 02:32, 5 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Retrieved from "https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File_talk:Incarceration_Rate_by_Sex_and_Country.svg&oldid=558057528"