User talk:Huntster/Archive 12

confused on my en-wiki page name

Huntster, i made this The Challenge (2022film) page on wikipedia. but i am confused after seeing posts of anatoly zak. on his website, he posted an article on Soyuz MS-19. This article confused me a lot as he said, Around the same time, Roskosmos and the Russian television Channel I were discussing the idea of sending an actress to the ISS with Soyuz MS-19 to shoot scenes for a sci-fi movie with the working title Vyzov (which in Russian language has a double meaning like "challenge" and "doctor's house call.") .

My article is named by the first meaning. Should i Change the name of my page or not. changing the page name will create complexity as several pages not only use this page link but also have translation of the word Vyzov in several places.

Moreover, though all other websites except russian space web are saying this film as either vyzov or the challenge, i cannot choose what other say unanimously as the other meaning is also significant since the lead actress Yulia Pereslid is playing the role of a doctor sent in space to conduct heart surgery of an astronaut, thereby some use of the meaning.

Actually i first blindfoldedly followed Roscosmos website saying the two soyuz ms-19 spaceflight participants, Yulia Pereslid and KLim Shipenko as expedition 66 crew, which was 100 percent conceptual, 0 percent reality. i made several changes at the end i got they are not a single day spending in Expedition 66 but they were at iss during expedition 65. this confused the page of expedition 66. ultimately i found after large observation that they were only space tourists. now it is said by anatoly zak sir too. i reverted all my edits on different pages with dissapointment. i dont want that mistake happen again. so please tell the correct one, Huntster.Chinakpradhan (talk) 17:20, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

No, your article is at the correct title. I've only seen reputable sources use "Challenge" or "The Challenge", and I'm led to understand that Вызов more accurately translates to the latter. Regarding their positions, they are nothing more than spaceflight participants, not crew. — Huntster (t @ c) 19:09, 4 October 2021 (UTC)

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on file deletion policy in english wikipedia

Huntster, i didnt understand the deletion policy in english wikipedia.

i uploaded the imagesFile:Soyuz MS-19 Official Crew Potrait.jpg and File:Soyuz MS-19 Crew Qualification Exams.jpg that were listed at Wikipedia:Files for discussion. this is thediscussion for first image and this is for second image. i participated in discussion and last comment was given by me for both the images. after the last one i visited the pages everyday to check for new comments in the discussion. suddenly today i saw the image deleted. (i dont want to discuss that i wasnt summoned for deletion after discussion. i just got a notification for discussion not about the discussion's outcome)

i wanted to dicuss that how can the image be deleted without any new comments against keeping the images. no one had replied to the last comment i made and it was deleted. if a comment was made i would have voiced at it. please help me in getting this clear at what terms the deletion happened.Chinakpradhan (talk) 08:06, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Huntster , Can you tell if this image is a free one or not Chinakpradhan (talk) 08:50, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, one at a time:

1) It appears you were notified of the deletion, I can see the notifications on your talk page. Aside from that, both are non-free images can can be replaced by a freely licensed image. It does not matter that such an image may be difficult to obtain, only that it is possible. Thus, both images fail the English Wikipedia Fair Use policy. Please try to remember that images only support an article, and are not required for any article. It also does not matter how many "keeps" an image gets if it fails policy. A clear violation is a clear violation, and no amount of argument can change that.

2) No, it is not a free image. It does not matter that it is posted on the NASA website, it was still created by Roscosmos. — Huntster (t @ c) 12:31, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, you won't be notified of the results of the discussions. It has never been done on en.wiki (or on Commons, for that matter), nor will it ever be, because the cost in time and effort is simply not worth it. We're all volunteers here. Also, when responding to talk page messages, please do not modify your existing text to answer, as you just did here. Place the answer below the last reply. Otherwise, it is difficult for people to follow the conversation. — Huntster (t @ c) 13:59, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

sorry sir i wil keep this in mind.Chinakpradhan (talk) 14:00, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

• It's simple enough: Fastily deletes everything.

Now, if crew photos aren't a justification of NFC in an article, why do any of our mission articles have them? Especially when on this mission, one of the crew is there precisely because of their looks (and no doubt their other acting talent). Andy Dingley (talk) 14:27, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Irrelevant who deletes it, Andy, though I agree that using NFCC 8 as a rationale is shaky. It's still a violation of NFCC #1. — Huntster (t @ c) 15:06, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Most other admins (but not all) they'll think about it, might keep it, might delete it. Not this one.

And where is the equivalent mission crew photograph for NFCC#1 going to come from? Andy Dingley (talk) 15:33, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

No, I...don't disagree on your first point, lol. As for having an equivalent, that is not required for NFCC 1. Merely the possibility that it could be replaced by a free alternative, regardless of difficulty. Yes, en.wiki is much stricter in its implementation of Fair Use than is actually required by law. — Huntster (t @ c) 15:40, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

ah Huntster, i have a question that is NASA TV different from NASA in terms of copyright policies. like i saw the image of welcome ceremony of soyuz ms 18 in the gallery of the soyuz ms 18 page, it is in non free version. please clarify this or if the copyright policies are same i propose to replace the image the commons image uploaded by me on which debate is started by this, instead of deleting it by croping the nasa blog image using wikitech's croptool.Chinakpradhan (talk) 16:45, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, that photograph was taken in the Zvezda module, so NASA is just rebroadcasting the Roscosmos video feed. No, it is not public domain. — Huntster (t @ c) 18:30, 5 October 2021 (UTC)

But someone did this being on Russian wiki Chinakpradhan (talk) 04:07, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, uploaded the photograph? That's up to the Russian Wikipedia to either allow or disallow. Each wiki is allowed to make their own policies, and the English Wikipedia does not allow it. There is no single Fair Use policy (or much of anything) that's universal amongst all the Wikis. — Huntster (t @ c) 04:56, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

I meant see Erick Soares3 published a commons image of the one I asked you being seen on nasa tv File:10 crew members in the ISS.jpg Chinakpradhan (talk) 05:16, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, thank you for bringing it to my attention. I have nominated for deletion as a violation of Roscosmos copyright. — Huntster (t @ c) 07:13, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Welcome back Chinakpradhan (talk) 07:53, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Huntster I don't want to say anything thing for or against the deletion but I saw in the welcome ceremony that oleg novitsky a cosmonaut not an astronaut was setting the camera, so maybe it mean what you said above being a roscosmos video feed as I don't see a us segment person using his camera for this live feed Chinakpradhan (talk) 08:09, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

So it may be rossian cameras only Chinakpradhan (talk) 08:09, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

btw, Huntster are all cameras in russian segment russian or can pictures taken from russian segment by nasa cameras, if any of the americans bring them to russian side to take a picture like this one is surely from russian side of iss taken by a american.Chinakpradhan (talk) 10:08, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, that's correct. Rights are determined by who takes the photograph, not the equipment that is used. U.S. astronauts take photographs from the Russian side all the time, and vice versa. Regarding the image you refer to, I can find no evidence that it was taken by anyone other than Mark Vande Hei, so it should be fine. I'll note that there is no EXIF data because Twitter scrubs it out, so it's possible reality may change. — Huntster (t @ c) 12:23, 6 October 2021 (UTC)

Duplicate file

Hi, Huntster! Came across this pair in different formats

1. File:PIA21500-Mars-GaleCrater-LakeStratification.png - Dr.Bogdan, earlier, used
2. File:PIA21500 - Diagram of Lake Stratification on Mars.jpg - PhilipTerryGraham, 1 day later, no usage except somebody's register.

If one name shall be used for the image, my opinion is in favour of Dr.Bogdan's variant (without 'Gale Crater', and much better, if also without the catalog code PIA). I've arleady enhanced Dr.Bogdan's upload (plan to use it in my 'Jezero crater'). Cherurbino (talk) 19:15, 17 October 2021 (UTC)

Cherurbino, because these two files are of different file types (png vs. jpg), they are not considered duplicates. It was decided long ago, unfortunately, that such files would not be considered for speedy deletion and must go through the full nomination and discussion process. In general, we just let them exist together, often tagging the inferior one with {{Superseded}}. I've gone ahead and done this to the JPG. Good work, regardless. — Huntster (t @ c) 20:35, 17 October 2021 (UTC)

Addendum: regarding the NASA identifier, I would strongly suggest using them in filenames (though I prefer to use them in parentheticals at the end of the filename, rather than the beginning) because they help guarantee a unique and easily searchable term; i.e., natural disambiguation. Just something to consider, and no one is required to use (or not use) them. — Huntster (t @ c) 20:39, 17 October 2021 (UTC)

unable to determine the copyright holder of this image. please help

can you help me in determining the owner of this image Huntster, please. i was waiting for it to be published on flickr and getting EXIF data as i see max 3 cosmonauts out of 5+1 astronauts(+1 for thomas pesquet) in each image. so i can neither predict the owner nor the cameraman without exif data which is not published yet. i am not also sure of this being a case of non free nasa tv element due to roscosmos broadcast.

i cannot risk again as i already uploaded wrong images to both wikipedia or wikimedia commons over these days (i.e. File:Soyuz MS-19 Official Crew Potrait.jpg, File:Soyuz MS-19 Crew Qualification Exams.jpg, File:Yulia Pereslid in Space.jpg, File:Soyuz MS-19 Official Crew Potrait.webp, File:Expedition 65 inflight crew portrait (2) with visitors Anton.jpg, File:Expedition 65 inflight crew portrait (2) with visitors from Soyuz MS-19 crew.jpg). so please help.Chinakpradhan (talk) 17:23, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, while it seems likely that Vande Hei took the photo, without direct confirmation from himself or NASA there is no way to prove who took it. I'm sorry. I'd like you to strongly consider not seeking images on Twitter in the future for this exact reason. It's simply too easy for a person to repost what someone else created. — Huntster (t @ c) 18:35, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Ok Chinakpradhan (talk) 03:10, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Ok Chinakpradhan (talk) 03:10, 19 October 2021 (UTC)

Changed SDC coordinates

Hi Huntster! I just wanted you to know that I changed the coordinates you identified on some of the ISS images such as File:ISS047-E-51596 - View of Earth.jpg from coordinates of point of view (P1259) to coordinates of depicted place (P9149), since "point of view" would be the spacecraft, and "depicted place" is the location you found. Great job at locating the images. Have a pleasant day. --Askeuhd (talk) 19:37, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Askeuhd, sorry about that, wasn't thinking terminology. Yeah, happened to be looking at the Wikimap tool and noticed clusters of these in areas that didn't correspond to the actual photos. Unfortunately there are vastly more of these types of ISS photos than I could possibly process, just in my general area. — Huntster (t @ c) 19:46, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Yes it's a shame that most of images are lacking this useful information. Sadly NASA only located a small number of the images in the catalogue. I am working on a piece of software, that should help us using image recognition, but progress is slow. I am pretty optismistic regarding urban areas though, since images of such have lots of distinctive features. --Askeuhd (talk) 20:43, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Askeuhd, that would be absolutely amazing. Please let me know how you progress with that, it's a great concept. — Huntster (t @ c) 21:08, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the support, and believe me, you will be the first the know, if I manage to materialize a working concept. --Askeuhd (talk) 21:22, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

unruly things done to the Contributions i made to wikipedia

Huntster, i am fed up with the unruly things going on in wikipedia. why am i not notified on changes like deletion on wikipedia. take this example, i have worked so much on this article. many a times i have got deletion request which i have opposed and won but this time i havent got any deletion noted after i have left the page on mission completion. today i came back due to crs 23 on inspiration4 page to find the image being deleted. all my contributions got lost and the current crew image is facing deletion discussion. if this one is who will be responsible for leaving the inspiration4 page without the crew image. my image cannot be blamed as it persisted on that page for a long time. this faulty free image destroyed the game. can you tell why this is happening and suggest a solution as i cannot go on checking the images i uploaded to wikipedia or wikimedia from the day i joined wikipedia without any notification. and can you be good enough to recover the image through undeletion process as i dont have courage to try the undeletion process myself as i have lost all the resources for undeletion with the deletion of my image. i will be grateful to you. Chinakpradhan (talk) 07:22, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

please reply, Huntster sir. Chinakpradhan (talk) 15:22, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, sorry for the delay, but I do have work outside of Wiki. Regarding this issue, the deletion of the crew photo was proper because under Fair Use rules, we cannot host images which could potentially be replaced by free equivalents. While it may be difficult to arrange for a crew photo to be created, it is not impossible that someone could. Take a look at Wikipedia:Non-free content criteria if you haven't already. This particular case is #1: "No free equivalent. Non-free content is used only where no free equivalent is available, or could be created, that would serve the same encyclopedic purpose."

I understand the frustration of having your images removed, but please remember that we're working with legal issues when it comes to image licenses. While it is always nice to have illustrated Wiki articles, images are not required at all. On top of that, for any Wiki article there should be a maximum of one Fair Use image on the page, and then only if the image contributes to the discussion of the article.

To another point, I do not know what you are referring to by "faulty free image". Can you link to it?

Remember, I'm happy to help you where I can, but we have rules for a reason, and in this case it is to protect us from legal consequences. — Huntster (t @ c) 20:40, 1 October 2021 (UTC)

Huntster sir, faulty free image is this one where you are also involved in it's deletion nomination page. Anyway but i have stopped getting notified of deletion, that i was asking mainly.Chinakpradhan (talk) 02:35, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, understood. Calling it "free" is what confused me, because it isn't free at all. — Huntster (t @ c) 02:47, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Ya faulty free I meant a upload of non free one in the name of free lisence. Anwyay Huntster I asked that like if you have seen these days i am busy in making pages related to soyuz programme but since for this reason I never have time to go about my previous uploads. I go back to my previous uploads only once I am notified of an issue related to it. So how I will know of a deletion tag applied on my uploads if I haven't been summoned about it and I also have Chinakpradhan (talk) 03:35, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Not being notified after it's deletion please tell why it's happening. the main topic i wanted to ask was not getting notified of changes in my articles. see i wrote take this example not talk on this example, that is, on the faulty or my non free deleted image.Chinakpradhan (talk) 03:54, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, I admit I'm having difficulty understanding your words. Without knowing the exact image that was deleted, it is difficult to guess why something was deleted. However, it may have been a housekeeping issue. If a file is being deleted because of a questionable copyright or some other issue that would result in the subject being removed entirely, you would normally be notified. If it is a housekeeping issue, like a duplicate image, you usually will not be notified since that image is being replaced by...the same image. Again, I don't know exactly what you're referring to, so I'm just making an educated guess. — Huntster (t @ c) 04:49, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

thats what i was telling which you said If a file is being deleted because of a questionable copyright or some other issue that would result in the subject being removed entirely, you would normally be notified. i was telling that i was neither notified about its deletion nomination nor after the deletion and thats the topic unruly things done to the Contributions i made to wikipedia and the latest example i gave was this. thats what i have asked you, being done wrong to me. Chinakpradhan (talk) 04:54, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, you will have to ask Explicit why they deleted the file without notification. I cannot read their mind. That said, while perhaps you should have been notified, I agree with its deletion as it unambiguously fails Speedy Criteria F7. — Huntster (t @ c) 05:14, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

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Huntster, like Cherubino discussed with you in september about similar images of ingenuity rotor assembly in commons one uploaded by him and another by Drbogdan, i am also in a conflict on wikipedia for two fair use images. it is on insignia of shenzhou 13 mission. my one is File:Shenzhou 13.jpg and another by [1] is File:Shenzhou 13 insignia.png just difference is that he is using a different name from me, he is using from cnsa website and i from collectspace he is with no backgroung and my one with black background. rest is same. i uploaded it 3 days earlier. if he is using for omitting black background, then its violating rules that a image is used for not description by decoration. moreover instead of publishing new one as just the background for my image can be removed easily. molly brown once did something of this kind with one fair use image of mine. i dont want both of them to be deleted by i insist that you please think and please remove only one of them. one thing i prefer is de;leting his one and removing background from mine. please help me in this.Chinakpradhan (talk) 06:53, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Chinakpradhan, if you feel one of them should be deleted, then take it to en:Wikipedia:Files for discussion rather than asking an admin to unilaterally delete the one you disagree with. The community can decide. Personally, I think his should remain since it would be the simplest solution and is technically superior. The artwork isn't yours, so don't be attached to it. — Huntster (t @ c) 09:12, 22 October 2021 (UTC)